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Bridgnorth Station redevelopment: 2012 onwards
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madderlake



Joined: 22 Jul 2007
Posts: 309
Location: Bridgnorth

PostPosted: Wed Oct 31, 2018 9:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

<Pedant mode> I think you will find stretcher bond refers to the way they are laid, joint to middle, and imperial refers to the dimensions, imperial not metric. I don't think either term tells you anything about any pattern on the face.
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hunter_i



Joined: 07 Jul 2003
Posts: 310

PostPosted: Wed Oct 31, 2018 10:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

What did one brick say to the other. Never LEGO
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hunter_i



Joined: 07 Jul 2003
Posts: 310

PostPosted: Sat Nov 03, 2018 10:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just rereading the GM's September comments where he said - "The pit location has been revised and is currently subject to a new planning application, costs are also being assessed for re modelling the loco yard at Bridgnorth to accommodate direct access to the turntable and provide space for Platform 2 extension."

If the idea is to extend Platform 2 to match the Platform 1 extension, then presumably this can only be done be narrowing the current spread of tracks into the workshop building. This may also provide space to move the turntable location closer to the workshop and place it on firmer (and cheaper) ground.

Considering that moving engines in and out of the workshop building is not a constant activity, the tempting thought arises of running the workshop tracks off the turntable.

I realise this would seriously limit the space available for storage and preparation of the service engines, and there is probably insufficient space for such a radical option.

However the GM's reference to re modelling the yard does sound interesting.

PS Has anyone tried to check the Council website for recent planning applications? My computer will not access.
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Robin



Joined: 07 Apr 2014
Posts: 464
Location: Stourbridge

PostPosted: Sun Nov 04, 2018 2:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

hunter_i wrote:
PS Has anyone tried to check the Council website for recent planning applications? My computer will not access.
One application was submitted in October for a 5m CCTV column in the new car park. Nothing new is shown relating to the turntable.
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hunter_i



Joined: 07 Jul 2003
Posts: 310

PostPosted: Sun Nov 04, 2018 8:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank Robin

One final observation on the GM's reference to direct access to the turntable.

It has long been proposed that the back road behind platform 2 be reconnected to provide greater operational flexibilty, with an additional run around path for locos, if for example both platform roads were occupied at the same time.

If the potential remodelling of the loco yard were to include this option, and locos could run around via the loco yard, then they could possibly pass across the turntable. This would certainly meet the GM'S description of direct turntable access.

It may also be relevant to note that with extremely limited space, to accommodate several tracks running off a turntable , they could be overlapped on the rim. Such complicated but interesting track work, might stimulate additional financial support from members.

Just a thought. As usual time will tell.
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Joe2027



Joined: 22 Jun 2007
Posts: 710
Location: Wednesfield

PostPosted: Sun Nov 04, 2018 9:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Robin wrote:
hunter_i wrote:
PS Has anyone tried to check the Council website for recent planning applications? My computer will not access.
One application was submitted in October for a 5m CCTV column in the new car park. Nothing new is shown relating to the turntable.


Looking back at the old planning applications, in 1993 a picnic area was planned for opposite platform one at Bridgnorth, under pan pudding hill. Why didnít it happen?
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threelinkdave



Joined: 22 Dec 2010
Posts: 696
Location: Stratford-upon-Avon

PostPosted: Sun Nov 04, 2018 11:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

hunter_i wrote:
Thank Robin

One final observation on the GM's reference to direct access to the turntable.

It has long been proposed that the back road behind platform 2 be reconnected to provide greater operational flexibilty, with an additional run around path for locos, if for example both platform roads were occupied at the same time.

If the potential remodelling of the loco yard were to include this option, and locos could run around via the loco yard, then they could possibly pass across the turntable. This would certainly meet the GM'S description of direct turntable access.

It may also be relevant to note that with extremely limited space, to accommodate several tracks running off a turntable , they could be overlapped on the rim. Such complicated but interesting track work, might stimulate additional financial support from members.

Just a thought. As usual time will tell.
Interlacing tracks on a turntable brings its own problems. The fowling point between two tracks moves a considerable way from the turntable reducing siding space
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hunter_i



Joined: 07 Jul 2003
Posts: 310

PostPosted: Mon Nov 05, 2018 4:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

One final, final comment on the turntable location.

I completely agree with the fowling point dilemma and I only had in mind a few track connections. The maximum 5 track width of the loco yard is 75 ft and the turntable diameter is 65 ft.

As noted in the Wiki entry for the turntable - "The difficulty of finding a suitable location at Bridgnorth was noted at the time, possible sites considered including the end of the head-shunt adjacent to Pan Pudding Hill, an area beyond and adjacent to the Boiler Shop, or south of the station beyond the advanced starting signal."

I have now been able to access the Council Planning site and have noted two potentially relevant entries. In the archaeological report for the field car park , reference was made to one test pit "on the site of the proposed turntable". However the location drawing shows that test pit more or less opposite the current coal bunker but up on the high ground - which cannot be right - it would certainly not suggest direct turntable access. In another diagram of the area there is a notation emphasising the current road passing the cottage is not be connected to the new field exit road (presumably for safety reasons).

With that road becoming an otherwise unusable dead end, it was the only available space for the turntable as presently located. See drawing below.

With such space limitations it is very hard to see a better alternative location in the loco yard without significant earthworks or demolition. Maybe the turntable is going elsewhere?

If these links don't work it is Severn Valley Railway Bridgnorth Planning Application 18/03035/DIS and document 29/7/18 proposes Site Traffic Management Plan.

https://pa.shropshire.gov.uk/online-applications/files/2E2C608841AB7127621EDBE6735CB13E/pdf/18_03035_DIS-PROPOSED_SITE_TRAFFIC_MANAGEMENT_PLAN-3344307.pdf

https://pa.shropshire.gov.uk/online-applications/files/2E2C608841AB7127621EDBE6735CB13E/pdf/18_03035_DIS-PROPOSED_SITE_TRAFFIC_MANAGEMENT_PLAN-3344307.pdf
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Derby4



Joined: 21 Mar 2009
Posts: 1847

PostPosted: Mon Nov 05, 2018 5:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

A number of images have been posted on facebook today, including showing some serious landscaping of the steep bank down from the south terrace to road level.
A hessian-type covering is being used to cover the now bare earth, perhaps this will act as a medium for the sowing of grass or wild flowers to stabilise the very steep slope.
The continued good weather must be a god-send for the final finishing of the outside work.

Rob
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Derby4



Joined: 21 Mar 2009
Posts: 1847

PostPosted: Mon Nov 05, 2018 5:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Deleted: Pressed the "submit" button twice!
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Derby4



Joined: 21 Mar 2009
Posts: 1847

PostPosted: Thu Nov 08, 2018 12:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

(pedant mode on) The missing piece of rainwater downpipe on the south end of the refreshment room is still missing. (pedant mode off...)

Rob

Edit 16/11 : Rainwater downpipe now complete as of today. Presumably minimal outside work still to complete, just as the weather is about to turn.


Last edited by Derby4 on Sat Nov 17, 2018 11:59 am; edited 1 time in total
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hunter_i



Joined: 07 Jul 2003
Posts: 310

PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2018 6:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

[quote="hunter_i"]
"I have now been able to access the Council Planning site and have noted two potentially relevant entries. In the archaeological report for the field car park reference was made to one test pit "on the site of the proposed turntable". However the location drawing shows that test pit more or less opposite the current coal bunker but up on the high ground - which cannot be right - it would certainly not suggest direct turntable access".

The new Turntable Planning Application is now available on the Council Website and as per my previous post, the turntable is in fact to be dug into the hill opposite the coal bunker. The access road leads off the first crossover into the engine yard, so there is minimal alteration to the existing yard tracks. There is also to be a GWR yard lamp adjacent to the turntable "to add authenticity to the scene".

A water column is to be located on the turnable access road, and with provision for an adjacent area of hardstanding, there will be the option to coal engines on both the access and nearby shed roads.

The new location makes greater use of otherwise unused field area, and it is no doubt cheaper to dig into the field than the original proposal to put substantial foundations over the lane.

I still feel it would have been nice to provide some form of cover for the service engines, and the new geometry of the turntable access road would now allow a new track running along the back of the workshop building. Using the existing workshop wall, this could be roofed over fairly cheaply to provide a single road shed, and there should still be space for a parallel vehicle access road running down the side to the front of the shed/workshop building and coaling area. A shed in that location would also be unobtrusive.

Trouble is such a track would have to run through the site of the existing coal bunker and oil store, but presumably a spot could be found for them?

My last link to the Shropshire Planning Applications Site did not work , but maybe someone with the necessary expertise could post the Site Plan on this Forum. Details as follows -

Reference 18/05183/FUL
Alternative Reference PP-07389879
Application Validated Thu 15 Nov 2018
Address Severn Valley Railway Station Lane Bridgnorth WV16 5DT
Proposal Construction of locomotive turntable reclaimed from Bath Road Bristol and associated enabling works
Status Pending Consideration
Appeal Status Unknown
Appeal Decision Not Available
There are 9 documents associated with this application.
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Graham



Joined: 21 May 2011
Posts: 1113
Location: The banks of the River Severn as it meanders through the sun dappled leafy glades of Worcestershire

PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2018 7:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Direct link to the Existing and proposed extension plans.
Direct link to the Proposed work detail plan.
Links to other relevant documents available on the planning application page.
There's also this interesting comment regarding a possible Civil War battery in the area.
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Bryan Clarke



Joined: 12 Jan 2011
Posts: 234
Location: Shropshire

PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2018 8:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

All very interesting BUT it is important to point out that all references to 'historical evidence' on the site of the proposed turntable are at best speculative - no one knows now, and will almost certainly never know, the historical and archaeological context of the site. The one time massive stone built Bridgnorth Castles inner configurations are in much part speculative. Any potential earth works at Pan Pudding Hill and its environs are even more speculative because of their short term construction, use and very nature of their environment - soft sandstone, clays and gravels. There have been archaeological digs, surveys and investigations for years, including by the renowned 'Time Team' which have added the sum total of nothing to our knowledge. Now the SVR is going to be asked to cough up yet more money in a search of Camelot, well a more than 300 year old earth built gun battery ! If there is anything it will simply add to the current speculation, as all the actual evidence has long disappeared down the slope and into the mists of time. The world has become lost in a never ending financial money tree fantasy.
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madderlake



Joined: 22 Jul 2007
Posts: 309
Location: Bridgnorth

PostPosted: Fri Nov 16, 2018 5:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

What I find surprising is that the job can be done with a grassed 'batter' providing an amphitheatre. I thought a retaining wall was going to be needed. Mind you, in the flesh, a 30 degree slope looks flippin steep.
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